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Online Debate Flares Over Columbia Pets for Purchase

A new Columbia pet and accessory store has spurred an online debate over whether pets should be sold in retail establishments.

 

An outcry by animal activists over pet stores that sell animals has broken out on Columbia Patch.

The activists say selling animals is obsolete and deprives shelter animals of good homes, but pet store owners who have been targeted by activists in other parts of the country defend what they say are honest legitimate businesses.

Charm City Puppies, a purebred dog and high-end pet accessory store that opened this month off Snowden River Parkway, sparked the conversation about pet stores, puppy mills and shelter animals on an article published Dec. 9 about the then-coming business. Nearly 130 comments have been posted — most of them since Saturday.

Animal advocates online said that reputable breeders don’t sell puppies to pet stores, and instead prefer to screen potential buyers to ensure puppies go to good homes.

Pet shops are legal businesses in Howard County and Maryland, and Charm City Puppies operates in a properly zoned retail space, Howard County officials said.

“Maryland is a pretty progressive state and full of animal lovers,” wrote one commenter, Linda Hauser. “I'm hoping [the business] will see the light and consider not selling puppies in the future and show a willingness to work with all the rescue groups who work so diligently to find homes for dogs in their care.”

Charm City co-owner Tony Cossentino declined to be interviewed this week, citing personal safety concerns in the wake of the online criticism.

Multiple attempts to get comments from other pet store owners in the Baltimore metropolitan area for this article were unsuccessful.

Animal rights activists have focused on stores selling pets in other parts of the country as well.

In July, a pet store in Corona Del Mar, CA, came under scrutiny from animal rights activists less than a month after the store opened, according to the Newport Beach Independent.

The activists accused the store of selling a puppy from a puppy mill — an accusation the store's owners disputed.

Co-owner Suzanne Bradford said the treatment her store received at the hands of activists "isn't right," and said she and her two business partners are "running an honest, legitimate business," according to the Independent.

Cossentino told Patch last month that he would depend only on USDA-approved breeders to stock his store.

The U.S. Department of Agriculture has policies regarding animal and plant health, said Howard County spokeswoman Alex King, and Cossentino would be required to have a special federal license if he is transporting animals across state lines.

Animal Advocates of Howard County Director Laurie Wallace said many activists are concerned about pet shops because they engage in the selling of living things.

"Getting a pet shouldn't be like going to WalMart to buy a tangible good," she said. "Pets aren't things, they are members of our family."

Patch writer Nikki Gamer visited Charm City Puppies Tuesday.

She found a small, pristine shop with seven puppies and dozens of boutique pet items for sale.

Instead of cages, the puppies were housed in pillowed cribs, and employees were dressed in nurse-like uniforms to give the appearance of a nursery, according to Gamer.

Meet-and-greet areas in the back of the store allow potential customers to interact with puppies.

Some areas of the country ban pet stores. In October, Global Animal, a news magazine about pets, wrote that shopping center developer Macerich said it would ban sales of live animals in more than 70 of its malls nationally, a move designed to “break the puppy mill business.”

According to an editorial in the Rapid City Journal, a newspaper in Minnesota, the move also broke a local business called Fish Here Pet Center, which had sold pets in that area since 1978.

“The policy …. may have been done for reasons that its managers believe are for a good cause — stopping puppy mills — but the policy is chasing away a tenant of 33 years that is not part of the problem Macerich is attempting to prevent,” according to the paper’s editorial board.

The business owners told the paper they didn’t get store animals from puppy mills—rather all came from local families, pets that would otherwise have gone to government shelters and faced euthanasia.

The Howard County Animal Shelter and Adoption Center, which must take any animal dropped off, took in 2,400 domestic animals and reptiles in 2010, according to Howard County police spokeswoman Elizabeth Schroen.

In 2010, the shelter took in 2,162 living dogs and cats. Of those, 1,074, or about 50 percent, were euthanized. Those included feral cats and animals with medical and behavior problems. The others were either placed in new homes or returned to their owners.

Fees at the shelter vary and depend on elements such as any medical treatment the animal may have received and whether it needs to be spayed or neutered, according to Schroen.

The Dogs XL Rescue group, a private shelter which specializes in placing larger dogs in new homes, charges $350 for puppies six months and younger; $300 for dogs from six months to seven years of age, and $250 for dogs 7 years and older, according to its website.

Wallace said her organization has been "inundated" with phone calls asking her to “do something” about Charm City Puppies, which, she said, is not her job.

"I certainly hope no harm comes to him," she said of Cossentino. "But I would hope he would take the time to sit down and talk with someone about a different business model to pursue. He could sell supplies and accessories but not the animals and do just fine."

This story has been corrected to reflect that Laurie Wallace is the director of Animal Advocates of Howard County.

  • Do you think pet shops should be allowed by law?

    (Voting has been closed for this question)
    • Yes. People should be able to shop as they choose.
        123 (29%)
    • No. The shops keep puppy mills in business.
        298 (70%)
    Total votes: 421
  • Your vote will only count once. This is not a scientific poll. View Results Vote!
Related Topics: Charm City Puppies, Columbia Business, Puppy Mills, USDA, animal activists, animal welfare laws, and pet stores

Jen Nussbaum

9:04 am on Thursday, January 19, 2012

As the "mother" of a newly adopted shelter dog, I do not believe that these dogs come from reputable breeders. If that is the case, I suggest and challenge Charm City Pets to disclose where they actually come from on the "cribs" of the puppies. The consumer can then investigate and confirm whether this is actually the truth or not. They should not have anything to hide if, in fact, they are actually telling the truth and are legitimate. There are so many wonderful, pure bred dogs that are given up every day in the shelters. Please do not advocate for this type of "business". It should be outlawed, in my opinion. True animal lovers would not consider "selling" animals. As far as the "gimmick" of the cribs and nursing outfits..to resemble "babies".....come on......obvious manipulation and playing on people emotions. Sad.

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KC

10:32 am on Thursday, January 19, 2012

Animal rights have gotten so emboldened that giving out the breeders information is akin to standing at your front door and yelling 'Hey Burglar, my house is unlocked and I have valuables inside'. In many cases shelters are raiding breeders, staging horrible conditions and taking the dogs and selling them for profit. This has beome quite a racket among 'rescue' groups. If there is an increase in purebreds in shelters, it is not because pet owners are turning them in, but because shelters are stealing them. Who is playing on people's emotions? Shelters. I use to respect shelters for the work they did helping truly homeless animals, but now they have turned into a questionable business boosting their sales by demonizing legitimate caring breeders.

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Dee

10:41 am on Thursday, January 19, 2012

KC - where are you getting this information from? I'm sure BARCS goes around snatching animals for their shelter. No one is buying this lame attempt at taking the focus from the real issue at hand...the suffering of the dogs in the mills. This really isn't an animal rights issue at all. It's about the male and female dogs suffering in puppy mills for their entire life until they are discarded like trash. You don't have to be an animal rights activist to think that is wrong. Your ordinary dog owner would tell you that.

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Jen Nussbaum

11:15 am on Thursday, January 19, 2012

Shame on you KC. I am not an activist, just a multiple pet owner. You have a right to your opinion but ignorance is not something I would put in writing.

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KC

11:29 am on Thursday, January 19, 2012

Dee, you have it wrong. The horrible images from years ago that are shown over and over again is NOT the norm. Your false statements about commercial breeding facilities have gotten stale and show your ignorance and/or show your animal righist attitude of hating ALL breeders. The increase in taking kennel's dogs with staging and exaggerations of conditions and going to a JP that is in ones friend has no place in the US. These actions are being challenged in more and more cases and hopefully will stop! Only then will there be plenty of dogs of all kinds for the people of this wonderful country to decide for themselves what dog if any is best for their situation and family.

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Sam

11:46 am on Thursday, January 19, 2012

Just ignore KC - he/she is just trolling. Can't name one case where things have been "staged", doesn't have one example of a "challenged" case, and quite frankly, accusing a Justice of the Peace of wrong-doing is pretty serious don't you think? This isn't about the proper breeding of animals. Quality, responsible breeding of bloodlines is absolutely fine. "Breeders" with "no more than 75" dogs on property aren't responsible. You don't have to be an activist to know that - you just have to be one hair shy of not stupid.

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Dee

11:49 am on Thursday, January 19, 2012

KC - you are living in a dream world. Check out information from Best Friends, ASPCA, Humane Society, and many others. Just so you know, I'm not against reputable breeders at all so please don't assume that about me! In fact, I purchased a puppy from a breeder 11 years ago (no, I wouldn't do it again as I have since become EDUCATED about the numbers of pets PTS each year and dying in shelters). Anyway, my experience with a reputable breeder was this: A lengthy phone conversation with the breeder with her asking many questions to be sure I knew the breed characteristics and to make sure that particular breed would be a good fit for me and my family, driving to meet the puppies who were only about 3 weeks old and seeing what conditions they were raised in and meeting their parents, having her encourage me to visit the puppies as many times as I wanted, filling out an application, giving personal references, giving vet references, signing a contract that said I would have the puppy neutered (as he was being sold as a pet), signing a contract that said I would only return the puppy to her if there was ever any reason I could not keep it. This breeder also made sure the puppy was socialized and exposed to a lot of experiences so it did not develop fears. Now how could a breeder ship their puppies to a warehouse for processing which then in turn ships them all over the country to pet stores never to know where their puppy ended up.

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Peggy Peters

12:06 pm on Thursday, January 19, 2012

KC, I am an animal advocate and I am friends with a few real reputable breeders. They do NOT sell animals to stores wholesale.They do NOT view their animals as simply stock the way these wholesale breeders do. The horrors of puppy mills is not antiquated as you are trying to persuade those who do not know better. Shame on you. Do you have a personal tie with this owner? None of us do, we simply want what is right. If you ever did some time working with animals in rescue that come from these mills each and every day then you would know your statements are false...but perhaps you already do. We do not want him to go out of business, just to do the right thing. It is important to understand that just because one has a right to do something, does not mean it is the right thing to do. Calling those of us liars who give our time and energy and money and mostly our love to rehab the animals that have been put thru this is certainly not the right thing to do. They can have a great business by selling that high end merchandise and adopting animals out for the shelters, rather than perpetuating the inventory breeding mentality. By defending mill breeding you are stating you care only for money, not for the animal. Most decent people find that very sad.

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KC

1:37 pm on Thursday, January 19, 2012

Oh boy, what a bunch of stale hogwash. And Sam typical....attack a poster personally when they speak the truth. I have fostered, done new home checks, gotten dogs out of the pound, taken dogs to their new homes...all for rescue. Numbers do not make a bad breeder. Commercial means to produce for the mass market with the aim of making a profit. Where does that say deplorable conditions and only breeding for greed? If this country relied on private in-home breeders we would have a huge shortage of dogs. The sad thing is that some states have passed laws labeling private in-home breeders as commercial therefore requiring the same regulations as the large commercial breeders which cannot be done in their homes. That means that the breeder will no longer be able to keep the puppies in a whelping box in their bedroom or be able to move the pups to a room when old enough to become accustomed to every day noises and smells. The animal rights are redefining them as commercial breeder and they will force these type breeders to just quit.....the true aim of all this baloney that is being spewed, here.

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MyBrandy

1:48 pm on Thursday, January 19, 2012

Wow. Again, KC, just name your sources, cite some articles. Simple as that. And why would advocates want to drive private home breeders out of business by forcing them to be tagged commercial? I'm not seeing what we would gain by that?

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KC

5:20 pm on Thursday, January 19, 2012

MyBrandy check out the new laws in Wisconsin, Louisiana and Texas. The threshold of numbers is so low they encompass private not for profit breeders.

Pieter Aarsbergen

9:21 am on Thursday, January 19, 2012

Boycott the store it's a front for the Mills!
There are thousands of really good dogs looking for homes!

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Dee

9:30 am on Thursday, January 19, 2012

I don't even know where to begin with this article. Yes, pet stores are legal. Yes, this pet store is pristine and cute and the owners love those puppies. No mention was made of the parents of these puppies who are bred to death, discarded when no longer profitable, and kept in deplorable conditions. Had the reporter gone to a puppy mill, she would have seen some very horrible things. Oh wait, puppy mills don't let people in to see their dogs. That's why investigators have to go in undercover. The article brings up the fact that the puppies are from USDA-approved breeders. Does the author know how meaningless that is? Here's a great link: http://www.humanesociety.org/issues/puppy_mills/facts/pet_store_doublespeak.html

The public needs to be educated on the whole issue of pet stores and puppy mills.

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Debby Hartten

10:38 am on Wednesday, January 25, 2012

Couldn't find how to start a new post, so this follows the previous one. Just for readers who are not educated about, or familiar with rescues, note that the fees that rescue groups charge for their dogs no where covers the tremendous costs they have to transport, provide medical care/up to date on shots, get spayed/neutered prior to adoption, feed, etc. Just don't want their fees evaluated the same as puppies at a store. Recues I promise you are NOT getting profit from their business. Quite the opposite and at their personal expense quite often. They are our heroes which is why this topic is such a heated one. Rescue groups also carefully screen homes and inform prospective owners about the responsibilities of pet ownership, and generally require the dog be brought back to their rescue if for some reason the adopter can't keep them. It is a lifetime commitment. Just don't want the adoption fees noted inappropriately compared by those unfamiliar with the topic.

Dee

9:35 am on Thursday, January 19, 2012

Here's a link to a pet store owner who got it right. He educated himself to where the puppies were coming from, was appalled by what he found, and changed the model of his store. It can be done!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BB8TNd3s4Ek

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holly

9:35 am on Thursday, January 19, 2012

What a truly disappointing article this is. 1) it's a shame that Mr C feels as though his personal safety is an issue, if asking a business owner legitimate questions on his FB page is threatening, then this country is more sad than I thought; 2) the fact that no other pet stores selling puppies/kittens in this area would give a comment should be a HUGE red flag; 3) many of these pet store owners turn a blind eye to being educated about puppy mills (or worse yet they ignore it) because it clearly affects their profit, I invite you to watch an interview with a store in Glendale CA that made the transition: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BB8TNd3s4Ek.....so of course every store concerned with the almighty dollar is going to defend what they do; 4) this story mixes in bits and pieces of other stories from other areas, which we have limited details about and we are expected to draw a quick opinion??; and 5) Howard Co took in only 2400 animals last year, and BARCS took in 12,000!?!?!!? I think someone needs to check the math (or the books/records at Howard County). How about visiting these 'reputable breeders' that these pet stores are using and reporting back the details and some pictures?

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MyBrandy

1:27 pm on Thursday, January 19, 2012

In addition, Howard Co Animal Control has fewer than 10 dogs on any given day, often as few as 4. Yet BARCS and other area shelters are overflowing. What is wrong with this picture?

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Charlie

8:58 am on Friday, January 20, 2012

Howard County has a wonderful spay/neuter program.They should be the role model for the nation. I think everyone should be excited when looking at the numbers of Howard County. It has taken them 10-15 years to get to this point. Keep up the Great work !

Sam

9:53 am on Thursday, January 19, 2012

All you have to do is to "google" the names of the organizations the owners claim their puppies are registered with and you will find that they're a scam designed to let people without a rudimentary knowledge of pet ownership think they are getting a "purebred" dog. Let's be realistic here - a "purebred" dog does not include anything with "doodle" in it's name, "poo" or "toy" - if one were to actually take a look at the AKC website and learn (hello, owners of Charm City Puppies! - take a look and do some REAL research) - you'll find that a) a reputable breeder will not sell to a store b) these "poos", "toys", etc are not recognized breeds - and just take a look at the facts....if you are getting dogs from a "breeder" with "no more than 75 dogs" on the property...IT'S A PUPPY MILL! In most places, that "breeder" would be called a hoarder, but because of lax regulations in some states, they breed the dogs like chicken and cattle - and sell them to ill-informed young people who thought it would be a "joke" to open up a store selling puppies in an environment to make it look they're babies. There is just so much wrong with everything these owners have said and done....and I own two pet boutiques in our local area. And we don't sell animals - we, like any responsible business owner; took the HSUS pledge to not be a part of the problem. Thanks Cossentino's for contributing to ignorance.

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holly

10:09 am on Thursday, January 19, 2012

KUDOS TO YOU SAM for running a pet related business that people WANT to see and WANT to support!

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Julianne StarMonkey Stammer Brown

11:58 am on Thursday, January 19, 2012

Sam...they have an Oripei (Pug/sharpei mix) available for adoption. :) But they swear it's not from a puppy mill. Sam KUDOS to you for being a responsible business owner. If you care to lend your advice to me on this subject (as we are leading this public outcry) please contact me on facebook under this name. Thanks so much for what you do and for speaking out! I would love to know what stores you own so that we could all support them!

Betsy Denning

10:00 am on Thursday, January 19, 2012

This article is ridiculous. People who are against the cruelty of puppy mills are not "animal rights activists"! Responsible breeders do not sell to pet stores. End of story!

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MF

1:49 pm on Thursday, January 19, 2012

Someone does not have to be an "activist" to recognize when a situation is wrong/outdated/contributing to a societal issue. I agree with Betsy - recognizing the issues with Charm City Puppies as well as other stores that sell animals from people who are breeding multiple breeds and litters at once (thus the accurate term "mill" can be used for someone mentioned by Cossentino churning out an astounding 75 dogs at once) and unfortunately helping stock already struggling & overwhelmed shelters and rescues. Assuming that the suppliers that Cossentino is using ARE taking good care of the animals in their care, they are still contributing to animal overpopulation and the suffering of related and unrelated animals.

And I hope that designer breeds - such as the "-oodle" mixes currently common in shelters - aren't what is being called "pure bred" by Cossentino and his suppliers. While each breed and mix has its own great characteristics, the suffering, shelter overcrowding and health issues that are resulting from flooding the "market" with trendy "designer" animals reflects a sad commentary concerning what people will do for a legal but unethical dollar.

Julianne StarMonkey Stammer Brown

10:07 am on Thursday, January 19, 2012

MY LETTER TO THE EDITOR---Hello again..this is the second time I have contacted you. I am very obviously the one leading this "movement" spawned by Charm City Puppies. I have asked to be contacted in regards to this story as I wanted to give our side. Our side meaning 95% of the people who commented on the original article. They have all gathered on Jericho the Phoenix's page..We have also started a Mid-Atlantic Coalition to End Pet Store Sales of Puppies and Kittens (inspired by Charm City Puppies). How on earth could you have excluded all this valuable information from your readers? Your publication is seeming one sided right now and I am hoping that isn't the case. I have everyone's support there and we are all formulating ideas and constructive approaches. I am wondering why you would contact a local rescue who's attitude was "it's not my job" when clearly we have taken on this task as our job. Doesn't make sense, unless you really don't want to hear the other side of the story. We are extending an olive branch to sit and speak and help Charm City Puppies. That would have fit right into your updated article...the person "not involved" who you did interview ..even said that....so why didn't you contact me?

Please contact me Patch Staff~~Thanks!!

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Julianne StarMonkey Stammer Brown

10:11 am on Thursday, January 19, 2012

FURTHERMORE~~~~ Here is a petition we started specifically FOR Charm City Puppies that has over 750 signatures in 3 days! HOW IS THAT NOT PERTINENT INFORMATION???? http://www.change.org/petitions/charm-city-puppies-adopt-dont-shop

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Julianne StarMonkey Stammer Brown

10:26 am on Thursday, January 19, 2012

How is the owner fearing for his life?? He is doing that to portray us as violent which we are CLEARLY NOT. I have asked the community for no name calling even!!! We want to sit down with him and negotiate...why is he fearing for his life?? Sounds like his own issue...nothing we did! Good attempt at making us look bad...anyone that is following us... knows he is lying to make us look like radicals.

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Chrissy Eckert

4:35 pm on Tuesday, January 15, 2013

Maybe the owner should fear for his/her life, if only to understand how all of the shelter animals would feel if they knew what their likely fate was. All sarcasm aside (no, I'm not threatening anyone) I tried to ask Charm City Puppies some questions about its business model and was promptly banned from their Facebook page. So they must be afraid of something. Probably any truth getting out to their ignorant fanbase.

Sam

10:43 am on Thursday, January 19, 2012

To KC - what an unbelievable statement. Most "shelters" are run by local governments or by organizations contracted out to manage them. They have absolutely no need to "steal" any pets. You provide not one piece of evidence to support your claim, not even anecdoctal. All you've proven is that there are just really stupid people in our midst.

Go spend a few days in a shelter and watch the people flowing in to drop off their pets because..."I have to move", "I don't have time for him/her", "He won't listen to me", "I can't afford it", "He's too big", "I'm allergic", "She's pregnant", "I don't want him anymore"....or better yet...watch how many animals are brought in by animal control because someone just let the animal go instead of making the effort to bring them in...that's the real truth. But, you don't care - you're trolling.

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KC

11:46 am on Thursday, January 19, 2012

I agree on the excuses given. Most dogs in shelters were from litters that a person thought would be cute to have or they let their dog run loose and came back pregnant. These people give their puppies mainly to friends and family. Once the novelty wears off into the shelter they go or the cycle starts all over. These are NOT dogs from pet stores or commercial breeding facilities. I use to think the same as you about pet stores, but I have been proven wrong many times by people I know who have healthy and happy dogs from pet stores. One large local shelter in my area no longer takes in strays. They are or were on 'Animal Cops' raiding unsuspecting breeders. The worse the fiilm makes it look the higher the ratings. It is disgusting. The shelter gets the dogs to sell, they get donations by crying to the public and then they charge the ex-owners inflated costs for boarding the dogs. The dogs that were in such poor condition to be taken from the owners are well enough to sell to new homes in days. NOW that is exploiting dogs and humans for profit.

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Dee

11:57 am on Thursday, January 19, 2012

KC - I also foster dogs for dachshund rescue. I can't tell you the number of people who have given up PET STORE puppies that they paid $1,000 because the novelty wore off. Tell your buddies at CCP we are more educated than they think and we are not all against reputable breeders who care to better the breed, not make money off of them.

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MyBrandy

1:40 pm on Thursday, January 19, 2012

Yes, KC, a long time ago my grad school advisor's favorite line was "Show me your data." Don't just throw out "on Animal Cops..." Give us a link to an article, an investigation, a video ANYWHERE in the country where shelters are raiding breeders and stealing their dogs. Right now, it appears you are spewing science fiction.

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KC

5:37 pm on Thursday, January 19, 2012

MyBrandy, Jean in Virginia ran a commercial facility. She was found guilty of animal cruelty and lost all her dogs. Her guilt was based on two old dogs that had less than perfect teeth. Her 2 vets with combined 45 years experience testified that the teeth were fine for their age and not causing the dogs problems. She had already scheduled a dental cleaning when the pound took all her dogs. Her guilt was based on the pounds vet that had a little over a years experience. Another case in Texas, the Gracias, bred birds. At trial, the prosecutors showed a picture of a dead bird in a water bowl as evidence of bad conditions. The next day the defense showed a video showing the animal control picking up the dead bird and placing it in the water bowl. The JP was in a different county than the Gracias and the JP's county has two deputies that are full time full salaried employess of another pound paid for cruelty investigations. The JP ignore this proven staging of conditions and found the guy guilty. Just google the names and states and you will find the stories. I don't lie.

Dee

10:46 am on Thursday, January 19, 2012

Oh Sam, I need to find out what stores you own so I can spend all my money there! :)

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holly

11:38 am on Thursday, January 19, 2012

'KC' is quite out of touch with reality. I don't even know where to begin with his/her reasoning because it's so 'out there'. BARCS receives over 12,000 animals a year, for all the reasons Sam lists, and more. I hardly think they have the time/resources to go out stealing animals to fill their cages! If this practice is so rampant as you suggest, then please put together a list of FACTS (with citations) that you have about our local MD shelters doing this. PLEASE educate us, not with random spurious comments, but with clearly researched/referenced FACTS on this matter. Don't be another person spreading information that you are unable to back up - that is in poor taste and not respected.

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Julianne StarMonkey Stammer Brown

11:55 am on Thursday, January 19, 2012

Jackie at Charm City puppies informed me they have an adorable OriPei...from a breeder named Tabatha Cannon. This is an example of a "USDA Breeder" that came right from the store itself. I also have the names of about 4 more breeders I was given during my conversation with them..don't believe me? Stop in to visit their adorable OriPei (Pug-Sharpei mix). Last I checked respectable breeders don't butcher the breed like that.

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Dee

12:05 pm on Thursday, January 19, 2012

She's another "breeder" in Missouri according to her cutsie little web site. Missouri is the puppy mill capital of the world. Approximaly 3,000 puppy mills there according to The Associated Press, May 2010.

Bob

12:55 pm on Thursday, January 19, 2012

Another pet store located in Columbia, "Today's Pet", has been operating in Columbia Mall for years. They too sell puppies from puppy mills. We know, we bought one there 11 years ago. never see any press about them though. Strange.

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MyBrandy

1:42 pm on Thursday, January 19, 2012

I agree, I have been wondering about that all along, why no one has mentioned them in all of the comments. Especially when they moved to a bigger and better location right down the road from CCP.

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Anne

7:16 pm on Thursday, January 19, 2012

Today's Pet moved out of the Mall well over a year ago & moved to larger quarters. I was told by a fairly reliable source that the owner had wanted to move to the vacant Bailey, Banks & Biddle store but Nordstrom nixed that proposal. Why anyone would purchase a puppy from a store is beyond me. Go to a reputable breeder who can advocate for the breed, introduce you to the sire & the bitch, & pick a puppy whose personality will mesh w/ yours - & who will demand that the dog be returned if things don't go as planned! He or she will also visit your home to see if YOU pass muster. With all of this do you REALLY think that a breeder would relinquish litters to a pet store? If you are determined to get a purebred dog, go to websites for breed specific rescue.

holly

1:52 pm on Thursday, January 19, 2012

Today's Pet IS on the radar screen.....not sure what folks have pursued in the past, but in light of this situation, they are in the forefront of everyone's mind in this protest......see comments sprinkled through original Patch article as well as on the 'Jericho the Phoenix' Facebook page......

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MF

1:54 pm on Thursday, January 19, 2012

I thought that the store was selling only "pure bred" puppies? An "OriPei" would not count, would it??

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Dee

1:56 pm on Thursday, January 19, 2012

Nope, in the old days, that dog would be called a mutt.

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Julianne StarMonkey Stammer Brown

3:08 pm on Thursday, January 19, 2012

An OriPei is an example of a "designer breed". These breeds are inventions of puppy mills to put a HOT NEW PRODUCT on the market. You can't make up a new breed of dog easily...so why not mix 2 right?? People will LOVE it!! In respect to designer breeds they have something people can easily find at a pound. A SPECIFIC MIX of breeds..no..mutts...heinz 57 dogs are NO GOOD..says the greedy puppy mills..

What they don't think about is the mixing of genetics. Every breed has a different makeup which constitutes health issues that are common to each breed..when you mix that..it opens up a whole new can of problems. But who cares right? They are a hot commodity. WRONG

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Anne

7:20 pm on Thursday, January 19, 2012

It should not any more than a "wolfdog" is as a designer breed for misguided humans. If you want to read a recent release that should make you angry, pick up HALF WILD @ the Library. Temple Grandin recommends it so that should warn you right away.

Erika Marion

2:58 pm on Thursday, January 19, 2012

This isn't just an online debate -- this is a local network of educated adults getting together (yes, using the internet as a common meeting place) to voice our opinion and organize efforts to make strides in what they (we) believe in!

I, personally, prefer the term "animal advocate" as opposed to animal activist because so many people take the word "activist" and turn it unnecessarily into EXTREMIST. Although when it comes down to it, I am an animal activist, but I have been keeping CLOSE tabs on all of the networking related to informing and educating people about Charm City Puppies & Today's Pet -- and so far I have not run across a single extremist.

It would really be nice if some of the efforts on the "activists" (advocates!) ends were recognized.. more than just quotes.

This is not limited to just an "online debate," it's a real life concern for other living animals. Stop by Mid-Atlantic Coalition to End Pet Store Sales of Puppies and Kittens on Facebook and see for yourself!

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Zazu

3:00 pm on Thursday, January 19, 2012

Nothing has changed for the puppy mill dogs in all these years and nothing will change as long as ignorance, and outright denial continues. It is a fact that these dogs are horribly mistreated throughout their lives. It is a fact they are crippled because of the caged conditions they live in. It is a fact their offspring are born and sold for pure profit with NO interest in how they live. Anyone ever get an invitation from the millers (i.e. greeders) to visit, open door policy, come and see our dogs? It will never happen because they know you would be horrified. Animal lovers will continue to be their voice, bust the greeders and get these dogs into proper homes after they have been altered and fully vetted. We will also continue to educate the children. The next generation will put an end to this criminality.

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Peggy Peters

4:26 pm on Thursday, January 19, 2012

Strange that anyone could be so adamant about defending this industry when so much proof to the contrary is available online and in person by visiting any one of the mill establishments or the countless dogs in rescue that have been over bred and neglected by them. All of us in rescue have seen this directly, in person and dealt with the animals who are victims of it so we know the truth. None of us have anything to gain but a clear conscience in working to prevent animals from being mistreated and misused for profit. ....cannot help but wonder what ulterior motive that one person would have to gain by fighting so hard against the good of animals.

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Sam

4:44 pm on Thursday, January 19, 2012

Here's some advice on how to make them both stop. Stop by their stores, find out the manufacturers of the products they carry, and start contacting the manufacturers of the products and let them know that it is not acceptable they allow their products to be sold in establishments such as these. Most reputable companies, especially those who sell to boutiques, don't really want the bad publicity that comes with being associated with these kinds of businesses. Contact the landlords, and let them know that this is not acceptable and you WILL do something about it. Tell the landlords that you will not frequent the surrounding businesses and let the surrounding businesses know that if they would like your business, to put some pressure on the landlord to not rent to businesses like this. It will take some work, and some time, but it will work - it's working all over the country, it will happen here. And, this particular business won't make it anyway, the young owners seem to not have it in them to stand up for what they believe in (if they truly feel puppy mills are fine), or enough education to even remotely understand the ramifications of what they have done, or the business savvy to not open up a business going the way of the Atari computer.

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holly

5:23 pm on Thursday, January 19, 2012

Excellent ideas Sam, some of which have been tossed out there before, but I would love to see us come together for a list of contacts/info.
1) we looked on SDAT but it was not obvious who the landlord is, does anyone else have a way to get this?
2) what other businesses are in that complex? I know Victoria's Gastro Pub is, and I sent them an e-mail early on (never heard back) telling them I can't come and enjoy a meal there anymore (I live about 20 min away, but have dined there a couple of times), they have an online contact page, and remember to leave these businesses very courteous, professional messages: http://www.victoriagastropub.com/contact_us/
3) I can't stomach walking into that place.....but if someone has a list of companies whose products they sell, I'd be one of the first to drop them a line!

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Vet Barnes

6:23 pm on Thursday, January 19, 2012

What you propose is illegal under the RICCO ACT. It is intimidation and you should be ashamed of your self for pushing such illegal activities.

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KC

7:15 pm on Thursday, January 19, 2012

Thank you Vet Barnes. Just listen to these people and they questioned my comments on the extent that some pounds go to in order to demonize breeders and take their dogs.

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Dee

7:55 pm on Thursday, January 19, 2012

How is Holly intimidating a business by simply telling them the reason she can no longer do business there and why? I'm not seeing the intimidation part. People make choices like that all the time. How about the sponsors of programs? People contact them all the time and tell them they won't use their product if they run a commercial during whatever show is ticking them off? I think Vet and KC are just trying to divert attention away from the real problem at hand....the treatment of the breeder dogs in puppy mills.

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Sam

10:08 pm on Thursday, January 19, 2012

Vet Barnes - everyone has the fundamental right to patronize businesses as they see fit; and to not patronize businesses as they see fit. They also have the right to tell businesses why they will not patronize them and to suggest ways that they could ensure retaining one's business. The Businesses have the right to say "see ya! Don't let the door hit you on the way out..."

We live in the United States.

If your statement were to be true, every single Occupy Whatever City should be charged in accordance with RICO for "Interference with commerce...".

We all have the right, should we choose to do so, to make our voices heard...haven't you been around long enough to hear about TV networks making changes because people boycott the advertisers? I'm sorry, I must have missed the breaking news about the organizers being charged with a federal crime.

It is not intimidation because there is no monetary gain from letting a business know why you won't go there or why you won't buy their products or to tell others how they can make their voices heard.

It is free speech.

Margaret

6:31 pm on Thursday, January 19, 2012

Simply put...No reputible breeder would EVER ship their puppies all over the United States to pet stores. Over 90% of puppies found in pet stores are from puppy mills...They may be prue breed, they may be "registered". It's all bull to mislead the public. The fact of the matter is that the parents of the cute puppies that will be sold for hundreds or thousands of dollars live a MISERABLE life. They are confined to cages, are not fed properly, do not receive clean/adequate water, do not receive vet care, are not groomed, are not loved. THEY ARE PRISIONERS! It is disgusting that anyone human being can consider this industry appropriate. I own a puppy mill survivor. My poor pup spend NINE years making some dirt bag money. Upon her rescue, she was groomed, placed on thyroid medication for a condition that was completely ignored and MOST OF HER TEETH were removed because she never received proper nutrition or vet care. Stop the excuses of why pet stores should continue to sell live animals. It is a national disgrace....
“If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who will deal likewise with their fellow men.”
― St. Francis of Assisi

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holly

7:20 pm on Thursday, January 19, 2012

See ya'll over on the 'Jericho the Phoenix' page where a TON of wonderful progress is being made on this and related issues from people who know and understand what is going on!!!!

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Anne

7:26 pm on Thursday, January 19, 2012

The RICO Act refers to Racketeering & Corrupt Organizations. It was originally used against drug dealers but is now available for use against any business, organization or group engaged in activities listed in the act itself. One only has to Google RICO & access a wealth of information. While Holly's heart is in the right place she is not practicing "intimidation" but she is misguided in her efforts. Instead locate the landlord for this strip mall & express dissatisfaction w/ the presence of this tenant. Blaming the GastroPub is inappropriate & misplaced.

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holly

7:50 pm on Thursday, January 19, 2012

Letting surrounding businesses know why you no longer patronize them is completely appropriate. If a brothel went in next door and people didn't feel comfortable eating next door to one they would tell the restaurant owner why. I used to enjoy going there, but I can't now. My message to them was not intimidating and in no way did I blame them, that would just be stupid. I simply told them that I can't comfortably sit and enjoy a meal there sitting next door to a puppy store! Most business owners like to know why customers choose to patronize/not patronize them, it's called communication! WOW, how far off topic can we get......that is usually how these forums end up. Done here.

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rescuepugluvinmama

8:09 pm on Thursday, January 19, 2012

I am disappointed in this article and am questioning whether the Patch is a legitimate journalism outlet or just a venue to sell ads for local businesses. I have several questions left unanswered. Whoever wrote this article for the Patch, please feel free to respond and answer. I only took one news writing class in my college days, and if I had turned anything like this in- I am sure my professor would not have given me a very good grade.
1. What kind of process do prospective buyers of dogs from Charm City Puppies have to go through? Anyone who has purchased from a reputable breeder knows that you can't just walk in and buy a puppy. There is a wait period and some sort of background check.
2. What are some of the names of the breeders that Charm City Puppies buys their inventory from? Furthermore, did the staff of the Patch even find this out & investigate further?
3. Will Charm City Puppies take back inventory that has been sold, but does not work out with their new family? Or will these puppies end up in a local shelter?
4. What happens to the puppies that are still on display in the store after they have grown up and are no longer puppies?

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Charlie

11:05 am on Friday, January 20, 2012

I am in agreement with you ! Excellent questions !

rescuepugluvinmama

8:12 pm on Thursday, January 19, 2012

I also find the following quote troublesome, "The business owners told the paper they didn’t get store animals from puppy mills—rather all came from local families, pets that would otherwise have gone to government shelters and faced euthanasia."
Why would these "local families" be forced to sell to Charm City Puppies and not be able to sell the puppies themselves? Why would these "local families" have to take the puppies to shelters to face euthanasia? According to the article, about 50% of the animals taken to the local shelter were euthanized because "Those included feral cats and animals with medical and behavior problems." So by any reasonable logic the author of this article is implying that the Charm City Puppies inventory is made up of animals that the "breeder" couldn't sell and would have gone to the shelter to be euthanized because they weren't adoptable? Not to mention, it costs about 75% less to adopt from a shelter than the $999.00 that Charm City Puppies is charging--- and that's not even including the cost of getting fixed. I am still convinced that getting an animal from the shelter is the way to go.

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Michelle

8:41 pm on Thursday, January 19, 2012

Puppy Mill puppies ARE the NORM for pet stores. "Local famlies" aka breeders, sell the puppies themselves to make money. Charm City wants to go into the puppy selling business to MAKE money or they would not bother with it! Wake up - it is blood money! Our local shelters kill dogs every single day - There is NO reason whatsoever that Charm City should sell puppies. They should do what the community needs ..... which is hold adoption events at their location instead of continuing to over tax the shelters and rescues. As a community we need to stand up and tell them we do NOT want you to sell puppies. We do not want to continue to allow puppy mills to flourish because pet stores chose to sell live animals. If Charm City sells live pets I will not shop there and I will remind my friends they chose to sell puppies.

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Nevie Brooks

9:22 pm on Thursday, January 19, 2012

just because it's a legal business does not mean it's an ethical business.

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Karin Emery

10:06 am on Friday, January 20, 2012

I'm reading through all the comments, sitting next to my recently adopted puppy - when he, his Mom and his 4 siblings were found, they were all starving. Someone had not bothered to have his mother spayed and when she ended up with puppies, the 6 of them were discarded. The Mom, and two puppies survived. One of the puppies had to be euthanized because she was in so much pain. Two others died when they couldn't be nursed back to health. The Mom is a full blooded, yellow lab. I'm sure she's not that old, and she and her two surviving pups are the lucky ones - they've all been adopted and are thriving. I'm sure the Mom was an adorable puppy when she was obtained by her original owners. Dogs and other pets are expensive, they require time, training and care. My puppy, whom I love, is a LOT of work. When people who have no experience with animals see these cute little puppies in stores they often don't understand the work and expense required to care for a dog. Dogs don't just become great pets, their owners worked HARD to get them that way. Dogs are also not a status symbol - if you're looking for a great pet for your family, it should not matter that your dog is a purebred. If this pet store really cared about animals they would focus on educating people looking to bring a pet into their home on the time, cost and effort required to care for a dog.

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Lisa

2:59 pm on Wednesday, January 25, 2012

KC--amen for some facts for some of these people! Not only have they obviously not gone in to talk to the owners, but they are making up these apparent "facts" about the shop. Instead of attacking you for facts, THEY should give facts. They have nothing besides ACCUSING them of carrying puppy mill puppies and ACCUSING them of this and that. Truth is, NONE of it is true. Saying that Mr. C should have no reason to fear for his safety so he won't comment is ridiculous? No YOU ALL are ridiculous. I know for a fact they have gotten threatening emails and phone calls so good job at AGAIN making assumptions. As for going to "rescues"--yes great...but not only is the Howard county shelter BARE most of the time because they KILL over 50% of their animals, but recently a maryland animal "RESCUER" had her animals taken away because she had dead animals all over her "rescuer" home....This pet shop is unlike any other and more of them need to be like this. It is a fabulous and well-kept place and a WONDERFUL place to get a puppy.
KC and Vet Barnes---I'm with you all the way. Bravo for your knowledge in educating these so called animal activists

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Linda

2:12 am on Friday, January 27, 2012

Thank you! I couldn't have said it better myself. We adored this place when we visited shortly after they opened. The puppies were beautiful examples of their breeds and the concept of the cribs is adorable. I'd much prefer to see them in this environment than in cages. The owners and employees were so friendly, well informed and clearly cared about the puppies. I, too, would be terribly afraid for my safety if I were the owner of Charm City Puppies because of the behavior of these so called activists. Extremists are known to do extreme things at times. By the way, I know where the shelters are, I've gone to them and sorry, but I don't want a pit bull, which is all I've seen probably 98% of the time. To each their own on that one. The other 2% have been large dogs, which need more space than I can offer. I've looked into breeders too, but there are none nearby for the breed we've chosen as a good fit for our family-which has nothing to do with pedigree btw- and I'm not willing to purchase a puppy sight unseen that I've never met and have it shipped to me. So what are my options? A beautiful, clean, well maintained store with caring employees that I can visit anytime to meet and play with puppies is a good one to me. Accusations are all I see here. Unless and until you know 100% that all you claim here is the absolute truth, these assumptions are ridiculous. And the folks who won't eat at a restaurant because it's near a puppy store? Really? No, you're not extreme at all!

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Chrissy Eckert

4:53 pm on Tuesday, January 15, 2013

Man, it's a shame Hoco shelter is the only shelter in the state. Oh, wait...

I'm not familiar with HoCo shelter, but I am familiar with BARCS, a number of rescue groups, the Humane Society, and the MD SPCA. None of which are hurting for animals - quite the opposite. The one rescue you cite is just that: ONE Rescue. She probably had no business trying to rescue so many, like a hoarder. CCP refuses to give info on which specific breeders they purchase from. I can find out which specific farm my milk comes from - why can't they tell me where my new family member comes from? Sounds suspicious. But, whatever. I totally neeeeeeeeeeeed that 100% purebred yorkie-sharp-poo-WTF-ever. Ugh. It's so shallow.

Vet Barnes

6:48 pm on Wednesday, January 25, 2012

There are several studies that show that "pet store dogs' are not usually found in shelters. The ASPCA has an interesting stat:
More than 20 percent of people who leave dogs in shelters adopted them from a shelter. (Source: NCPPSP) so retention and "shelter returns" are a bigger problem than "pet store" dogs in shelters.
Rescues and "humane societies " transport thousands of dogs per year around the country in large trucks and vans for "adoption" at places that are "short on dogs" ( isn't that the idea .. to be "short on dogs"?) many of these dogs become ill after transport on occasion bring disease that were previously unknown to the population of dogs in the area they are transported to and are rarely temperament tested or minimally... the background of the dogs are unknown,.. and amazingly enough many of these are touted as "puppy mill rescues' that are matted, urine soaked etc and classified as unsocial.. however after a few days they are miracle of mircales "ready for adoption"
To call every commercial breeder a "puppy mill" and "disreputable' is a falsehood that needs to be addressed. also from the ASPCA site:
"The majority of pets are obtained from acquaintances and family members. About 15 to 20 percent of dogs are purchased from breeders, 10 to 20 percent of cats and dogs are adopted from shelters and rescues, and 2 to 10 percent are purchased from pet shops. (Source: Ralston Purina and NCPPSP)"

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Vet Barnes

6:52 pm on Wednesday, January 25, 2012

So if only 2-10 percent come from pet shops it is difficult to believe that many dogs in shelters come from pet stores unless everyone else keeps their dogs ( disproved by the stat re: shelter returns above). I have cared for many pet shop puppies and many lived long and healthy lives. I cannot say the same for shelter pets most of them came in with serious illnesses or diseases. Particularly comes to mind a mixed breed puppy from a shelter who passed his worms on to his new owner who then lost his eye to the parasitic infection. His owner was a boy of 14. We rarely hear about the healthy animals from pet shops because there is no emotional story for fundraising.
Note that "The average number of litters a dog produces is one a year; average number of puppies is 4-6. " Every year 16 million people are looking for pets. With only 2.6 million shelter animals available there is no way only show breeders can supply enough pets. But, I forget the goal of animal rights is to end pet ownership. Even shelters are running out of dogs. Note the number of shelters who have to import dogs to sell. If only "purebred hobby breeders" are breeding dogs there won't be enough dogs. This is already happening. As the noose is drawn by groups like HSUS pushing legislation to eliminate ALL dog breeders by using words like 'puppy mill" and "back yard breeder" and yes even "responsible breeders ( few can meet that criteria set down by them) dogs will become more rare and much more expensive

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Andrew Donald

2:22 am on Wednesday, June 27, 2012

you are either a complete idiot or a puppy mill breeder, probably a breeder. you write the same comments on every single animal welfare website. please no one take this man seriously

rose bauman

3:38 pm on Thursday, January 26, 2012

Not to worry,vet Barnes, the "rescues" will ramp up their efforts importing small,desirable breeds not only from different states but from different countries,allow even more "cute",small breed dogs have litters than they already do, and will continue to "adopt" them intact to make sure they will not run out of desirable small breed puppies they can "rescue" and find "forever" homes for!

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Dee

7:46 am on Friday, January 27, 2012

I swore I was going to stop commenting to the uneducated, conspiracy theory people on here. Everyone who commented against this store is not an extremist, so please stop making generalizations. You are forgetting one thing about that cute puppy in the store...the horrible conditions the mothers and fathers have to live in year and year out. The owners of this store have said they get their puppies from Missouri (the puppy mill capital of the world). Chances are very good the puppies' parents are living in horrid conditions and being bred to death. If you don't want a shelter dog, please make sure you can see and visit with the parents of your new puppy. That is the ONLY way to be sure you are not getting a puppy mill dog. I don't think that's an extremist view at all.

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randi

11:48 am on Saturday, January 28, 2012

@Dee,

Wow, that's a bit of a generalization. How do you know the pet store puppy's parents are living in horrible conditions? Your saying so doesn't make it so.

And Dee,how much of the income of the Humane Society of the United States actually helps abused animals? And were you aware that PETA operates one and only one shelter in the whole United States and kills 95 percent of the animals it take in. The links you provided are fine for what they are: propaganda. Anyone can create a website and endorse anything they want. Any fool can cite it. An insightful person would research both sides of the question and form their own opinion and I have. The HSUS, ASPCA and PETA have their own agendas and very little of it includes helping the warm, fuzzy puppy at your local shelter. Most of their income is dedicated to making sure they generate more income; their "cause" could be anything. They use animals because it suits their purposes and generates big bucks.

Julianne StarMonkey Stammer Brown

7:27 pm on Monday, February 13, 2012

Recently, two members of ReLove Animals Inc. visited Charm City Puppies. The following includes the facts from that visit.

On February 5 at 11:29 a.m., Tony Cossentino stated in response to The Sun's article ..."As the owner of this store, I would encourage customers who are curious to come in to the store and visit directly. We will gladly set the record straight on any questions you may have about us and our puppies. We might just change your mind about what you think of puppy stores. I will not respond further on this forum because it is too easy for certain individuals to bully us online with unfounded things that they would never say to our faces. None of the opposition has even visited the store to see for themselves, not even the leader. Please search 'Charm City Puppies' on Facebook for more information. Thanks, we love you Charm City!"

We visited the store on Thursday, February 9th. The store is lovely and clean, with a nice variety of products. The puppies were cute and seemed relatively happy in their cribs.

Part 1 (cont)

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Julianne StarMonkey Stammer Brown

7:27 pm on Monday, February 13, 2012

Upon arrival at the store, we first spoke with Jackie Cossentino, one of the owners, who later called her husband Tony to the store for further discussion. We discussed the public's concern about the puppies coming from puppy mills and asked for their list of breeders. Tony refused to give us the information but said he would give it to anyone else. If that is information you are interested in, please visit the store. They did say that they get their puppies from a broker, The Hunte Corporation located in Goodman, Missouri.

We tried to discuss a humane business model that many pet stores in the country are transitioning to, one which only adopts out puppies or dogs that are in shelters or rescues, but the owners of Charm City Puppies were not interested. We would welcome the opportunity at any time in the future to once again sit down and discuss this business model with them.

We are pursuing our plans to have educational demonstrations in order to educate the public on puppy mills, what they are, and that almost all pet store puppies come from puppy mills (according to several national animal welfare organizations).

We are excited to report that we have been in contact with other pet stores who are willing to sit down and learn about a humane business model. One of them is very interested in transitioning to not selling puppies and instead only offering rescues for adoption. We will keep you updated on the progress we are making.

Part 2 (cont)

Julianne StarMonkey Stammer Brown

7:28 pm on Monday, February 13, 2012

For more updates on our upcoming educational demonstrations, links regarding pet stores, puppy mills, and animal welfare, and other ongoing developments please join our Facebook page 'ReLove Animals Inc.'

Part 3

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Mother Goose

12:44 pm on Tuesday, April 9, 2013

There are problems with each way of acquiring a family pet unless you deal with a bona fide breeder. I would say a "bona fide" breeder would be someone with a passion for a particular breed of dog or cat. This persons animals receive excellent medical care, are not bred in such a way as to endanger the mothers health and the mothers are not killed when they can no longer produce income. This breeder should be able to allow you to meet the parents of the puppies/kittens and allow you to choose your puppy/kitten from the litter. The breeder will ask you for almost as much information about yourself as a mortgage broker AND verify the information. If the breeder asks you to wait in a specific area while they retrieve a puppy/kitten for you, RUN! There is probably a very good reason they don't want you to SEE the area where they are housing the animals they have for sale. I am not a breeder. I have a coworker who shows and breeds Maine Coons and a family friend who ran a boarding kennel and bred retrievers until they were physically unable to maintain the operation.

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Mother Goose

2:04 pm on Tuesday, April 9, 2013

Part 1) The reason there are so many pure bred (or appear to be pure bred) cats and dogs in the shelters is because people often purchase a pet because it looks adorable and it’s so cute and cuddly. They do little to no research about the breed. They are unable to realize that tiny bundle of fur could or will grow into a dog that weighs 60 to 100 pounds or more in some breeds. They have no idea how much it costs for veterinary care such as wellness checks, spaying or neutering, vaccinations and preventative medications. They’re unaware of how much time is required to maintain certain breeds of dogs AND cats coats. They’re on their way home with the new pet totally oblivious of the number of times they leave work to meet up with friends for drinks and/or dinner and what happens when Fido needs to use their outdoor lavatory while they’re partying. Will that ball of fur still be so lovable when they come home to a puddle of pee or a steaming pile of poop?

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Mother Goose

2:06 pm on Tuesday, April 9, 2013

Part 2) Will the puppy still be cute and cuddly after it digs a hole in the carpet, shreds paper or tissues or destroys the sexiest pair of heels you own or will he be on his way to a shelter in the morning? Do they know if their puppy is one of the breeds that is a puppy for up to 2 years and unless trained will chew everything including furniture? Regardless of the weather that puppy will still need to go for a walk or outside to relieve himself even when the pet parents prefers to lounge indoors during bad weather. Do they know if a certain breeds barks more than another and could annoy their neighbors until the police are at their door?
If they take home a kitten do they know how much damage those claws can do when they come out? Have they ever seen what cat claws can do to furniture and drapes? Have they ever attempted to clip a cat/kittens nails? Have they ever been face down cleaning a litter box which MUST be cleaned at least daily? Do they know that ball of fur could leave some stinky surprises to let you know how unhappy they are with how their litter box is being maintained? Do they know how hard it is to get the odors from those surprises out of carpet? Will this be when they dump the cat/kitten at a shelter? Do they think they might like to clean a puddle of slime with a wad of hair in it or would this be something that would have the cat/kitten on the way to a shelter?

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Mother Goose

2:08 pm on Tuesday, April 9, 2013

Part 3) I hope this sheds some light on how so many pure breeds end up in shelters. I doubt anyone is stealing them to fill shelters since there are more than enough humans who are unable to THINK before they leap into a situation. These would be the same people who are always exempt from blame because nothing is ever their fault, it’s the stupid animal. Those of us on the other end receiving that unwanted and possibly abused animal don’t see it that way. We are the ones who have to try to comfort that animal as it whimpers and shakes in fear and HOPE that someone will come in and give it a home before it has to be euthanized (KILLED) to make room for the new batch of unwanted cute and cuddly balls of fur.

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KC

2:22 pm on Tuesday, April 9, 2013

There is NOT an over population problem. If healthy dogs are dying in shelters it is the shelter's fault. There is a shortage of dogs and that is why hundreds of thousands are imported into the U.S. or sent from state to state. The ONLY increase in purebreds that are in shelters is because they are stolen from sound breeders under the guise of abuse. Open your eyes people. You are being fooled

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MF

3:06 pm on Tuesday, April 9, 2013

I am having trouble finding logic in your comment. It seems that euthanasia rates would be low if there were no "supply" - right? Not "3 million to 4 million a year" (ASPCA). And where does the resupply of 3-4 million EACH YEAR come from if not from over population? From imports? From people importing dogs from other countries? Maybe you didn't explain your point clearly and can answer these questions with some thought. "Hundreds of thousand...imported into the US or sent state to state (do you have a stat for that?)?

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MF

3:33 pm on Tuesday, April 9, 2013

Even if all shelters euthanized only sick or behavioral issue dogs, & you were correct that "there is NOT an over population problem" then it would be challenging for me to go to a shelter & find it full or partially full of dogs; some of the ones there actually "stolen from sound breeders under the guise of abuse." Would you agree? There would be empty cages. Not many too choose from. The shelter could charge higher prices b/c they aren't just covering expenses but making $ b/c there is a "demand"- supply & demand laws - right? Running a shelter could actually be a profitable business given your logic. Given your logic, it doesn't make sense that there are 172,945 healthy mixed or purebred dogs looking for homes (there is a shortage of dogs! Are they making these profiles up!?). given your logic, I could actually pick up the rare stray or lost dog & call a shelter & say, "Can you just keep him safe for a few weeks - can you just shelter him - until his owners find him?" And they would say "Sure!" b/c there is actually a shortage of dogs in the US. All 26 stray dogs that I picked up last year would be outliers, by your logic & I could've made & selling the purebred ones. People who wanted a dog WOULD HAVE TO contact a breeder, be on a wait list at a shelter or rescue, or import one from a country with dog overpopulation issues & deal with required quarantines. And I would do all of these things to have a dog. Because, like you, I love dogs. Right? Or am I being fooled?

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KC

3:48 pm on Tuesday, April 9, 2013

I am not going to do your research and homework. You can start with the Center for Disease Control for the numbers of imports and the problems it causes. Per TUFTS In 1973 65 million cats and dogs with 20% dying in shelters 1990's the number of cats and dogs increased to 110 million with a 4.5% dying.The animals put down include very sick, vicious and old dogs. Any shelter that claims pet over population and uses that as a reason to kill healthy animals should be closed and prosecuted. Now do some work and find out the facts and stop listening to emotional pleas by greedy groups that call themselves shelters

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MF

5:02 pm on Tuesday, April 9, 2013

Again, looking for logic - given the stats you provided above - that there was an approximate 4.5 million increase over 17 years in euthanized animals. It seems like there are a disturbing abundance of animals to euthanize- not a shortage. Right?

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Mother Goose

5:38 pm on Tuesday, April 9, 2013

KC, if you actually think there is a shortage of unwanted dogs, please check out a site called Petfinder.com. Look at the number of dogs in this area alone who need homes. It is NOT the fault of the shelters that they have to put animals down. They have limited funding and limited space to house animals that someone decided they didn't want anymore. Take a good look at the number of older and senior pets who need homes. Who keeps an animal for years and then abandons it as if it's an old pair of shoes? When people show up at shelters and rescues the 1st thing they ask to see are the puppies and kittens. It's hard to get them to look at the older animals.
I don't know where you are getting your information but I'm getting mine first hand from the sources. Perhaps you could volunteer at one of the rescues so you can SEE for yourself? You'll find out quickly why so many have to limit the amount of time they can spend in shelters because it will break your heart.

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KC

6:45 pm on Tuesday, April 9, 2013

I am an active volunteer for a rescue group in my state. I just did a home visit Saturday. I have fostered and pulled dogs out of the pound, taken them to the vet, groomed them and delivered dogs. I fully understand that older dogs are harder to place than younger but they can be placed and I am fully aware of some of the heartless reasons people dump their animals at pounds and the people that are the biggest problem who have oops litters and it has become okay to use the shelter as a dumping ground. And of course I know Petfinders the largest vehicle used to sell/broker animals on the internet. Pet households are up and euthanasia is down. Animal Rights (not the same as animal welfare) have effectively used pet overpopulation as a tool for donations. There is absolutely no reason but bad shelter management to kill a healthy animal.

KC

5:47 pm on Tuesday, April 9, 2013

OMG there will always be animals (as long as animals rights do not succeed in their agenda to end all companion animals) that need to be euthanized for extreme illness, viciousness and just plain old age. Logic escapes you. The stats I used showed that the numbers have decreased in the millions over the years. So either shelters are lying about killing healthy dogs or they should be prosecuted

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KC

6:15 pm on Tuesday, April 9, 2013

Oh I get it MF, you are asking these daft questions as a joke?

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MF

7:02 pm on Tuesday, April 9, 2013

Yes! Yes! You've finally got it! Euthanized animals! Wasted tax dollars! Suffering and mass produced and processed animals - all a big joke! Glad you have humor and ability bow low since you are not able to logically clarify points. Come on - you can spend another year responding to every person who has experienced and learned what you won't admit - we have an overpopulation of companion pets and you don't want to acknowledge that b/c you want to run a pet store, make a living, and not deal with the ugly side of what that means. Fair enough. Plenty of people do it in other careers, right? Why don't you at least be a smart business owner in the meantime? The business model is 1) copied, 2) controversial (OK, - do what you believe is your life's calling but you've caught the negative attention of animal people and they see the worst humans can do to some of our most vulnerable so they aren't going to forget about you, and 3) apparently inefficient, since you deal with a middle man. This isn't just about being "daft" concerning humane issues, but business as well...ever thought of at least going local? Selling the dogs out of environmentally friendly cribs? Something innovative and more attractive? Come on! Give us something to work with here!

MF

6:25 pm on Tuesday, April 9, 2013

Well, yes -your logic escapes me! There are some words missing from your info, which may have helped, but it does look like "dogs INCREASED to 110 million with a 4.5% dying" the evidence you chose doesn't support "shortage of dogs" theory. It appears, at least, that you may actually have issue w/animal people/shelters/rescuers/tax payers taking issue w/you/your business/someone you know business/the business model of selling dogs bred for commercial (vs. personal) sale, when you feel that shelters are euthanizing healthy dogs? Well, guess someone could be lying as you suggest, but still issue with TOO MANY animals: as a tax payer, it is outrageous the money wasted on euthanizing animals (45,000 in MD each year, that adds up to $8-9 million!) that others bred/adopted/bought/were given. Politicians on both side of the aisle agree, which is why the Senate in the MD Gen.Assem. voted overwhelmingly to pass the Voluntary Low-cost Spay/neuter bill, SB 820/ HB 767 (or is this part of the "agenda to end all companion animals" vs. reducing wasting tax payer dollars and reducing suffering? Are you for proactive approaches & efficient use of tax dollars, or reactive use of tax dollars for euthanizing? ).There will be animals that need to be euthanized -no one is arguing that so not sure what your intended point was. An issue is WASTING tax payer dollars-animal lover or not-when reducing overpopulation is an option that you object to b/c it doesn't suit you or a business model personally.

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KC

7:04 pm on Tuesday, April 9, 2013

So your logic is even worse than your math. In the 70's there were 65 million cats and dogs and 20% were euthanized or 13 million. In the 90's there were 110 million cats and dogs and 4.5 were euthanized or close to 5 million. Today there are about a 140 million cats and dogs and as you quoted 3-4 million are euthanized. Of those 4-5 million are the very sick, vicious and very old. Nope not a big over population problem. You must be one of those people that think one dog is over population and if there were no dogs there would be no killing. Is that your logic?

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MF

7:19 pm on Tuesday, April 9, 2013

Yes! You are correct! 1 dog = overpopulation. I have 2 so don't know where that puts me...overover populated? Double populated? Listen, you don't really make sense, and you obviously very close to the situation at Charm City Puppies, so best of things to you and yours. Hope that you find peace in all aspects of your work, but it seems that will be a bit in the future given your devotion to this thread and defending the sale of production puppies. I sincerely hope each of your dogs, and all of the dogs sold via mass breeders, receive good homes. Your store looks very pretty and your staff probably enjoy the dogs. None of those things, of course, are the issue, and we all know that. It is a beautiful day, and I have two rescued dogs who want to get out and enjoy it. The best to you.

MF

6:47 pm on Tuesday, April 9, 2013

Wow. Hunte Corp., which Charm City Puppies reportedly uses, turned out 90,000 puppies in 2007 - what a production! They don't even appear to be the breeder, but the middleman: "we probably rejected 30 percent of the puppies brought to him because of the quality, but that is less than 10 percent now." That may equal 9,000-27,000 "low-quality"/rejected dogs. What happens to them? (The preacher's kid's comment concerning "God's work" is interesting). CCP- you may be in the wrong line of work - at least the wrong part of the production line! No wonder you have high prices if you are the third one with the "product"! From the article:
How the Hunte Corp. processes puppies
1. Eight-week-old puppy sold to Hunte Corp.
2. Hunte performs veterinarian check, gives booster shot.
3. Grooming and/or minor surgery if needed.
4. One- to five-day stay at Hunte.
5. Second veterinarian check. Shipped by semitrailer to pet stores
6. Arrive at pet store.
http://www.tulsaworld.com/article.aspx/Puppy_Showcase/071118_1_a1_amwor01213

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KC

9:15 pm on Tuesday, April 9, 2013

You need to take your meds or eat some red meat

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Kimberly Woodhead

8:43 pm on Thursday, April 11, 2013

Stopped in this evening. Shop smells strongly of urine. Caged areas in front have clearly been wet, and puppies are walking/laying in it. Puppies in 'cribs' are laying on hard plastic with no bedding. Large puppy in back room in a small cage howling...clearly distressed/hungry. Cage way too small for this poor animal. Horrible experience for a true animal lover. $999.00 for a puppy seriously limits their chances for being adopted. Owners...shame on you. You are obviously NOT concerned for nothing other than your pocketbook. Have mercy on these poor animals. Take them to the local humane society where they have a better chance of being adopted by a loving family for a reasonable price, and cared for as they should be.
A visitor from out of state...

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